# Appendix — Dayton Board of Education v. Brinkman > Briefs, arguments, decisions, and more. URL: https://www.frixlaw.com/law-library/documents/brief%3Amicro_IA40385005_1894%3A03 ## Record - **Collection:** Supreme Court brief - **Document type:** Appendix - **Published:** January 1, 1979 - **Citation:** 441 U.S. 903 ## Text res | 9 APPENDIX war 3 8 Volume II | MICHAEL ROBAK, JR..CLENK IN THE eee ee SUPREME GOURT OF THE UNITED STATES OCTOBER TERM, 1978 DAYTON BOARD OF EDUCATION, WILLIAM E. GOODWIN, JOSEPHINE GROFF and JAMES D. HART, Petitioners, Vv. MARK BRINKMAN, PATTY BRINKMAN, and PHILLIP BRINKMAN, By Their Mother and Next Friend, Donna Brinkman, et al., Respondents. On Writ Of Certiorari To The United States Court Of Appeals For The Sixth Circuit Petition For Certiorari Filed October 13, 1978 Certiorari Granted January 8, 1979 TABLE OF CONTENTS Volume II Page VII. RELEVANT PARTS OF THE RECORD OF TWENTY VOLUMES TRANSCRIBED DUR- ING THE VIOLATION HEARING HELD IN DISTRICT COURT IN NOVEMBER AND DECEMBER OF 1972 (R. I.) (Continued from Volume I) V. Testimony of William Marquardt ........ 351-352 W. Testimony of Nelson Whiteman ......... 352-367 X. Testimony of Walter M. Bagwell ........ 367-382 Y. Testimony of Ralph Curk ............... 383-413 Z. Testimony of William Goff ............. 413-423 AA. Testimony of Lorana Madeline Dorsey .. .423-424 VIII. RELEVANT PARTS OF THE RECORD OF THE REMEDIAL HEARING HELD IN DISTRICT COURT IN FEBRUARY OF 1975 (R. ID.) ... 6... eee ee ee ee reese eee ypees 425 A. Testimony of Robert O. Greer .......... 425-428 B. Testimony of Gordon Foster ............ 429-433 IX. RELEVANT PARTS OF THE RECORD OF THE REMEDIAL HEARING HELD IN DE- CEMBER OF 1975 AND JANUARY OF rete N Gee cevss es veces cecees 433 A. Testimony of William M. Gordon ....... 433-437 B. Testimony of Larry W. Hughes ......... 438 C. Testimony of John B. Maxwell .......... 438-439 D. Testimony of Gordon Foster ........... 439-443 II. X. RELEVANT PARTS OF THE RECORD OF FOUR VOLUMES TRANSCRIBED DURING THE REMAND HEARING HELD IN DIS- TRICT COURT IN NOVEMBER OF 1977 ee ei eat ae A. Court and Counsel Commentary ......... Wayne M. Carle .........:.eeeeeeeeees John Treacy ........cccceccesscesecece EE TN oi vi cn ec dessscssnesiuunn QA nO & Page 351 V. TESTIMONY OF WILLIAM MARQUARDT. [R. I. 1721-1722, Vol. 17]. Q. Would you state your name, please? A. Willard Marquardt. Q. And are you associated with the Dayton Board of Education? p Yes, sir. In what position, Mr. Marquardt? Director of Athletics and Physical Education. How long have you held that position? I think this is my fourteenth year. And just what does this position involve? Well, it involves a great deal of all the athletic scheduling and hiring of officials and trying to get sites to play ballgames and physical education and health and safety quite a lot. Q. Are you involved in any type of city league that is in existence in the City of Dayton? A. Yes. Our office makes all the league schedules for all sports. Q. What teams comprise the City League? A. We have eleven of them. Do you want me to name them? Q. Are they the high schools in the City of Dayton? A. Yes, they are all eleven high schools. Q. Now, have you made a search of the minutes of the Athletic Board to determine when Dunbar became a member of the Dayton City League? A. Yes, sir. Dunbar was a full member of the Dayton City League in 1948. Q. And since you have been Athletic Director of the Day- ton Board of Education, has Dunbar participated in the City League with all other high school teams in this league? A. Yes, sir, they have. rOPOP OP 352 [R. I. 1736, Vol. 17] Q. Do you get into the question of whether or not other teams — the question of whether or not there are other teams that the teams may schedule besides the City League games? A. No, sir. Each school has a faculty manager of athletics and they are responsible for making up the complete schedule of non-league games. They can make them either at their school or away, whichever they desire. Q. And in football and basketball there has been this innercity competition between all the eleven teams in the City League, is that correct? A. Yes, sir. W. TESTIMONY OF NELSON T. WHITEMAN. [R. I. 1737, Vol. 17] Q. Would you state your name, please? A. Nelson Whiteman. Q. And are you presently associated with the Dayton Board of Education? A. Yes, sir. Q. And what position do you hold? A. Principal of Patterson High School. [R. I. 1739-1747, Vol. 17] Q. How many classes or grades were involved in this school at that time? A. At that time, three years, three grade levels; tenth, eleventh, and twelfth. Q. And how long was Patterson Cooperative a three-grade school? Unitil 1968. And what three grades would that have been? Ten, eleven, and twelve. Now, you indicated that it was a vocational type school? OPor we 353 A. Right. Q. How were the students recruited for attendance — first of all, was this an all citywide school? A. Yes, sir. Q. How were the students selected or recruited during the period of time that you were there, from 1953 up until the spring of 1967? A. We had a team of coordinators and counselors that visited the other high schools in the city and put on an as- sembly program for the ninth grade students in those schools to explain to them the opportunities that were available at Pat- terson Cooperative High School. Q. And did you visit or did the teams visit all of the high schools? A. Yes, sir. Q. And were you a part of this team? A. Yes, sir. Q. What high schools did you visit? A. Oh, I visited Fairview and Belmont, Wilbur Wright, Stivers, Roth, Roosevelt and Dunbar. Q. Now, during the period of time that you were in the Patterson Cooperative High School, from 1953 through the time it became a four-year high school, were there any spaces available for any additional students in this school? A. Yes, sir. Q. Now, during this period of time, up until it became a four-year high school, were there any efforts made by the staff at Patterson to obtain more black students at Patterson? A. Yes. In one incident I can recall particularly in Feb- ruary of 1965, we had a special luncheon for the principals and guidance counselors of the black schools in Dayton to try to enlist their help, to encourage more black students to attend Patterson. Q. And this would have been when, in ’65 did you say? A. February of 1965. Q. Now, Patterson became a four-year high school in 1968? A. Right. 354 Q. At this time your recruiting would have taken place, I take it, in the spring of 1967, when applications would have been received? A. No, your applications would have been received in the spring of 1968 for the fall of 1968. Q. All right. Could you tell us what were the considera- tions tl at went into or how you decided to select the freshman students that were taken into the student body in the fall of 1968? Well, I’m not sure I know exactly what you are asking me. Q. All right. Let me restate the question. A. Okay. Q. Your procedure before was to visit the high schools. A. Correct. Q. Now, as I understand it — well, let’s go back to 1968. On the applications, what considerations — when you became a four-year high school, were there an increase in applications at that time? A. Yes. Q. What were the number of increases? A. Well, when we were a three-year high school we never had as many as five hundred applications for any one year. We were going to shoot for five hundred applicants at the freshman level, and the first year we had 1200 applicants. Q. Now, how did you decide to select the students from the various schools when it became a four-year high school? A. Well, when it became a four-year high school the selec- tion of students then took place at the elementary level, at the completion of the elementary school, rather than at the freshman level of the high school, and we decided that the fair way to do it would be to give every school so many places of those students that were to be selected. The first thing we did was to establish the total enrollment of eighth grade students that year, citywide, both public and private schools. 355 That was right in the neighborhood of 5,000 students. We were shooting for an enrollment of 500 that year. So we guar- anteed every elementary school that we would take ten per- cent of their total eighth grade enrollment. Q. And that was ten percent of each elementary school in the City of Dayton? A. That’s right. Q. And did you do that for the start of the year for 1968-69? A. Yes. Q. Now, were there any other criteria or selection processes that were gone into rather than, I guess we call it, the ten percent? A. No. Again, I'm not sure I understand your question. Q. Of the students that applied, where did they apply for admission to the school? A. Well, we had a printed application form that they could pick up either from their counselor or their principal, which- ever it happened to be, and they could return the application blank completed and signed by their parent to their counselor or principal, and then we made a return visit to the school for an interview with each student. Q. Now, at any time after it became a four-year high school, was the policy for selecting students changed? A. Yes. Q. And would there have been a change in the year 1970- 71? A. 1970-71? Yes, we went to a selection criteria that Dr. Durant, along with Dr. Goff, helped us to work out to make the selection more objective. . Q. And could you explain that? A. Well, I don’t know what you mean. Q. What do you mean by being more objective? A. Well, it was felt that the counselors of our school had too much authority in the selection of students previous to 356 that, and that the selection should be more objective than subjective. Q. And was there any change then in the policy of selection in the year prior to 1971-72, the registration period? A. Yes. Q. What was that change? A. That year, which would be the present freshman class, the students were selected by lottery. Q. And was there any basis or change in that at that time? A. No. Q. Were there any criteria established for percentages on ratio on black or white or female or male? A. Yes. Again, the first thing established is the total num- ber of eighth graders in the city, and then the percentage of black students citywide, so the percentage of black students citywide is the same as the percentage of black students except in our freshman class. Q. And that became effective what year? A. This year, this school year. CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. LUCAS: Q. Let’s, if we can, put the policy in reverse order. You said in 1971-72 students were selected by lottery? A. That's right. Q. Now, does the 10 percent rule still apply? A. Yes, sir. Q. So you get your pool. Is it from all of the elementary schools you take? You see how many eighth graders you have? A. Right. Q. And 10 percent from every school are eligible to go into the pool, is that right? A. Well, it’s not 10 percent every year. The percentage depends on the total enrollment of eighth grade students city- wide. The percentage may vary from one year to the other. 357 Q. Okay. When was the 10 percent rule instituted? Was that 1968? A. That was the first year we were shooting for 10 percent. Q. Okay. That 10 percent has been dropped, is that correct? A. Well, the percentage varies from year to year, de- pending on the total enrollment. Q. So there is no flat 10 percent rate? A. That’s right. The flat figure is 500 freshmen each year. Q. Now, before 1968 how did a child get into the school, before you had the freshman class? A. Okay. A freshman in another high school would make application directly to the vocational division he wanted to enroll in. Q. The vocational division at Patterson, is that right? A. Right. Q. He would not go through his counsellor and be in turn recommended to you? A. No. We visited the schools, and as we visited we visited the high schools, and put the presentation on for the fresh- man class, and as we visited they could pick up application blanks and other literature from us, but then they returned them directly to us. [R. I. 1748-1764, Vol. 17] Q. All right. And then the counsellors made the decision as to how many students would get in. And how many would you take in an average class before 1968? A. Well, before 1968 we would take most anyone that applied, providing he was passing and had a good attendance record. Q. Okay. Before that time, since 1914, really, when it was founded, Patterson had operated below capacity, is that correct? A. That’s right. 358 Q. In 1968 — I’m sorry. Let's go back. Were you there in 1953? A. I came there in the fall of 1953. Q. All right. Was there any black teachers at Patterson at that time? A. No, sir. Q. Were there any black counsellors? A. No, sir. Q. And the admission process was through black counsel- lors, is that — I’m sorry. Through the counselling department in each division? A. Yes. Q. All right. And how long a period was it before you had any black teachers at Patterson? A. I can’t answer that exactly. In the early ’60’s we had one black teacher in the medical arts department, but I can’t — Q. I’m sorry? What department? A. Medical arts, but I can’t tell you the years. Q. Allright. When did you get your first black counsellor? A. ’68 or ’69. Q. So until that time the primary admitting unit, or until 1968 at least, the admission process was through the counsel- lor, and you had no black counsellors, is that correct? A. That’s correct. Q. By 1969 how many black teachers did you have? A. 1968? Q. Yes. A. I don’t know that we had any. I can’t say for sure but I don’t know that we had any in 1968. Q. Was it the 69-70 school year that you got your first black counsellor? A. I would guess the 69-70 school year, yes. Q. Right. Now, was it the 68-69 school year that you had the policy change about the 10 percent? A. No. The ’68-69 school year was the first year for the freshman class. Q. All right. 359 A. And the 10 percent was established for the first year because the total enrollment city-wide was 5,000, and we were shooting for a mark of 500 freshmen. Q. So you took the 10 percent for each school for the ’68-69 school year? A. Right. Q. That’s what I want to understand. Now, what was the admission process, the ‘68-69 school year? If you can just sort of trace for me, what the average child who was interested in Patterson, what process would he follow to get in? A. Okay. In the 68-69 year we visited the elementary schools and: we put on a program that was very similar to the one we put on in the high schools, to present to the students the opportunities that were available to them at Patterson Co-op. Q. Was this an all white presentation team? A. In ’68-69, probably. Q. Go on. A. We left then application blanks in the elementary _ schools for the students to pick them up from either their counsellor or their principal. In some schools they didn’t have counsellors at the elementary level, so they had to pick them up from the principal's office. They had to take them home, have them completed, and signed by the parents, and returned to the counsellor in their elementary school. We then went back and interviewed those students and made our selection from those that applied. Q. Now, when you say we, do you mean the team or the usual counsellors from each department? A. A team of counsellors. Q. Isee. And do you generally draw your team, one from each department in the school? A. We did, yes, the first year, and we did when we were visiting high schools. . Q. So essentially it was still the same initial process through 360 the counsellors, except the source of applications was more organized? A. Right. Q. Is that a fair statement? A. Yes. Q. All right. Assuming you had 10 percent from each school — I am not sure yet I understand how it works. Can we do it with numbers? A. Yes. Q. Give me an example of a school you had a freshman class to fill. Ro A. Let’s say Westwood School had 100 eighth graders. We were going to take 10 from Westwood School. Now, they may only have 10 apply, but we will take those 10. If they had 40 apply, we would take 10 from the 40, but if they have 100, we still will take 10. Q. Using the 10 percent figure, that would be sufficient to give you a full freshman class? THE COURT: Let me ask one question, if I may. You indicated you conducted a lottery. Is it a lottery at each school that has in excess of the percentage number? THE WITNESS: I am not sure I understand your ques- "tion. THE COURT: All right. Let’s assume this example; You have 100 eighth graders and you are going to take 10. Forty apply. Do you conduct a lottery among those 40? THE WITNESS: Yes. ° ° oO Q. The lottery was not in effect in 1968-69? A. No. The lottery was only in effect for the present school ear. : Q. I think you have got me cleared up on 1968-69. How many new students did you take in? A. Five-hundred. Q. Is that all freshmen that year? A. No. Well, the 500 was freshmen. I didn’t answer your question correctly, and I am sorry. The 1968-69 school year, 361 we had to take two classes, a freshman and a sophomore class. We took 500 freshmen or approximately 500 freshmen. Q. Now, before you added the freshman class to the school, am I correct that you started with sophomores and they stayed in the school full time and took the regular curriculum and at the lith and 12th grades they worked two weeks and had two weeks of study? A. That’s right. Q. So, their first year coming into the school was a ques- tion of Ketting them a job. They had a regular curriculum in the school unit; is that correct? A. That’s right. Q. And that continues today even though you have four grades, freshmen and sophomore students have their school- ing in the self-contained school unit and in the 11th and 12th grades they do the two weeks of work and two weeks of schooling? A. That’s right. Q. Are there any students in the 11th and 12th grades who do not do the two weeks on and two weeks off and take just only school courses? A. From time to time there are, yes. Q. I mean, is a student absolutely required to do the work part of the program under the four years school that you now have? A. Yes, that is part of his program. Q. What if you can’t get him a job? I don’t want to use kicked out, but is he sent back to another school? A. No, not always. We keep them. Sometimes they are, sometimes they aren’t, depending on the student and the circumstances, but normally a student that is doing well in school and has the job potential, we will keep him until we find him a job. Q. And if you are unable to find him a job because of the depressed labor market or what have you, would you just keep him on through graduation? A. Yes. 362 Q. And he gets the same kind of degree the other students do? . Toe . r on you said that in 1970-71 there was another policy changing that that Dr. Durant and Dr. Goft had worked out, some policy criteria for acceptance of children? . Yes. 9 What was the reason for adoption of this ger dh A. Well, there has always been in some of the other schools the feeling that the counsellors from our school or the cO- ordinators from our school had been too subjective in their selection and not objective enough in the criteria selection rat- ing scale that they devised which was an attempt to become more objective rather than as subjective as it had been. Q. You say this has always been a problem? | A. As long as I have been there. Q. Is an asoiain that came about in 1968-69? You have had a problem before? A. No, we have always had the problem. Q. As I understood it, you took in anyone who was in ‘ good standing before that because you had plenty of excess P . . ok That’s right, but the criticism was there in spite of it. , . [am sorry . : The criticism was there in spite of it. . ' Q. Even though you took everybody who applied an was in good standing? A. That's right. : . You didn’t reject anyone : Only those that were failing or had poor attendance ds. . ts In 1970-71, was there any particular acceleration of this criticism as a result of the adding of the freshman class? A. Yes. ry Q. Was that the first time you actually limited enroll- ment at Patterson? —. 363 A. No, no. The limited enrollment was in 1968-69. Q. And therefore, in 1970-71, you had this criticism and you attempted to deal with it by setting up these criteria? A. That’s correct. Q. And I take it that didn’t satisfy the criticisms. A. That’s right. Q. So, you adopted what you call a lottery method in 1971-72 where you take the percentage city-wide depending on you needs in terms of an entrance class which is 500? A. Right. Q. You take the same percentage from each school? A. The same percentage from each school. Q. Is it the percentage of the 500 that you divide up among all the schools or do you take a percentage of the — suppose School A has 500 people who want to go to Patterson whereas School B only has 2. Do they still get the same 8 percent or 7 percent quota? A. Yes, Q. So that a child going to one school where there are more children applying for Patterson may be excluded from Patterson because his school’s quota is filled; is that right? A. Would you state the question again? Q. Okay. Let’s take Jackson Elementary. Suppose under the quota you can take 10 children. A. Okay. Q. You can take 10 children from Jackson and you have 40 who want to go. A. Okay. Q. Obviously there are 30 children who don’t get to go to Patterson. A. Right. Q. Whereas Shoup Mill might have 2 children who want to go to Patterson and have a quota which would permit 5 or 6 more children to go. Is there any provision for filling the va- cancy by letting some of those other children from Jackson who wanted to go take up that gap in the quota? A. Yes. 4 364 Q. How do you work that? A. Once a quota for each school has been established and selected, then those schools who have not met their quota, all the students that have not been selected go into a city-wide pool and then they are selected from that. Q. And how do you get your racial quota now? A. How do we get it now? Q. Well, you told us how you figured it. You took all eighth graders in the city and then you took or you figured out what percentage black that was and that was the percentage you tried to have in your annual class; am I right? A. Right. Q. And all I am asking is how do you go about doing that? Does it automatically happen that you get that percentage black or do you have to use some other techniques to achieve the percentage of blacks that there are in the eighth grade system? A. You have confused me with your question. Q. Let me go back. It is my fault, I am sure. Let’s assume that your percentage of black children in the eighth grade is such that you require 200 black children in the entering freshman class. A. Yes. Q. Suppose under the formula, the way it works on a lottery, you only get 150. How do you go about getting the other 50? A. Well, the city-wide pool is divided into boys, girls, black and white, and they will select them out of the city-wide pool. Q. And you don’t use a lottery on that pool? A. Yes. Q. Well, how do you make sure you get the extra 50 black children in my example? A. Well, we ask the computer service to draw us the extra fifty blacks out of the city-wide pool, be they boys or girls. Q. If there are 500 blacks in the pool, then you take 50 by lottery from the black pool; is that right? A. Yes. 365 ~ Q. What is the purpose of setting up these criteria? A. You mean the percentage of black and white? Q. Yes. What is the purpose for doing that? A. It goes back to our original purpose, I think, of trying to get as good a cross section from the entire city as we can possibly get. s You say your original purpose. How far back does that go ; A. In 1968 when we became a four-year high school. That is the way we set it up then. ne In ees y get a cross section from the city as a whole you have to look at factors such as race and s d thi ; this sort; is that. correct? ia von sd A. Yes, sir. Q. And that’s the technique that the scho i ol has devised for doing? ies Yes. ag fora black children were in Patterson in 1968? Yes. I do not know. Approximately? Are you talking about percentage-wise or numbers? Either way. I can’t answer that. POPOrPOrO> ° ee re ° A. If I read this correctly, in 1968, right wi ae = percent, Am i Q. Right. What about the other > that on the exhibit? pee. ius _ A. 1969, 22.2 percent; 1970, 29.8 percent: bs and 1972, 32.9 percent. percent; 1971, 31 percent; Q. How about 1963, do you have that figure on there? 1963, yes. That is 1.8 percent. - How do you account for the small nu mb students in Patterson in those years? Sct 366 A. What year are you talking about? Q. 1963 and 1966. A. I am not certain I can account for that period. We visited the black high schools the same as we visited all other high schools. I know that black students were reluctant to come to Patterson High School much moreso than students from other high schools, and I don’t know the reason for that. Q. Were they discouraged from coming in any way? A. Not to my knowledge. Q. Were they not told of the difficulty getting them jobs because of the discrimination in the job market? Were they told that? Yes. We certainly didn’t tell them that. The counselors didn’t tell them that? No, sir. . How do you know that? Were you present when coun- selors met with the students? A. Iwas on the counseling teams that visited. Q. Would you agree with Superintendent French when he said that that was the reason why blacks were not taken into Patterson, because you couldn’t place them in jobs? A. That may have been one of the reasons, but we certainly didn’t tell students that, and we never discussed that in any kind of a staff meeting in our building. Q. Was it a problem that you had? A. I don’t know that it was a problem because we never had enough black students in those days to test it. Q. Do you recall in 1958 at the time that the policy was announced the policy changed adding of the extra grade at Patterson making a statement that you were still working on this area of job discrimination by employers and there is still some areas where there are problems but it is being eliminated? A. Yes, I can remember that. Q. Do you remember making that statement? A. I don’t remember making the statement, no, but I can remember us working on that problem because there was QOFroOror 367 some job discrimination, but we never had an opportunity to test it to any extent. MR. LUCAS: Your Honor, I have a clipping I would like to exhibit to the witness and see if it refreshes his recollection. 2. sa that refresh your memory of that meeting? . No. X. TESTIMONY OF WALTER M. BAGWELL. [R. I. 1780-1782, Vol. 18] Q. Would you state your name please? Walter M. Bagwell. And where do you live, Mr. Bagwell? 5531 Wolfe Road, Dayton, Ohio. And are you presently employed? Yes, I am. And where are you employed? At the Sinclair Community College, Director of Physical ry POR >OPOPO> And basically what do you do at Sinclair? Responsible to the Board and coordinator between the aa and the contractor for the construction of the col- ege. Q. And what is Sinclair? A. It is a junior college. Q. Is this a new building that was constructed? A. It’s 4 new building. Q. And before your position with Sinclair College, where else were you employed? 2 : ey eyo by the Dayton Board of Education. - And in what capacity were yo ] - i ss ty you employed by the Day: A. As Assistant Superintendent in char ge of business. THE COURT: In charge of what? ye THE WITNESS: Business. 368 Q. And how long did you hold that position? A. Iwas acting superintendent from June until November, 1953, as an appointee to the job in November of 1953 until June of 1969. Q. And is that your first association with the Dayton Board of Education, June of ’53? A. No. I came with the Board in June or July of ’52 as assistant tq. Mr. Carlson who was the Business Manager. Q. Yof were assistant, then, and took over as Business Manager the following year? A. Right. Q. And as Business Manager, what were your duties or what did your job involve? ; A. Primarily I was responsible for the operation and main- tence of the existing plant which included the cafeterias maintenance and operation, for the planning and recommenda- tion of architects in the construction of new buildings. [R. I. 1783-1784, Vol. 18] Q. Could you tell us during the period of time that you were with the Board what cri- teria you used for site selection of new buildings? A. Well, primarily the site selections were in the area where the children were and, of course, along with that was the economics of it. The schools work closely with the city in locating their schools adjacent to playgrounds if they happen to be in the same area where the students were located or lived. Q. Were there any other factors that you took into con- sideration? * A. Yes. All of the schools had to be within walking distance which the Board had set up from their homes to the school site, and this was normally the case. Transportation was not provided for them unless it happened to be a hazardous situa- tion for them such as highways that had no sidewalks or rail- roads that had to be crossed. 369 Q. Now, you indicated that you were building the build- ings where the children were. Did you take into consideration where they may be? A. Yes. We bought a couple of sites on the basis of antici- pated enrollments on the basis of plans that had been sub- mitted to the City Planning Board, and we bought sites for those locations with the intent that if the development went ahead, we would build schools there. Q. How did you determine where the children were going to be or may be? A. From the plans and plats that were submitted to the Planning Board, we received a copy of those for review to get an idea of the layouts to see that there was adequate walk- ways that would permit access from the plats by streets or by dedicated easements that would lead to the schools. [R. I. 1788, Vol. 18] Q. And where is Carlson located again? : A. Carlson is on the southern end of Gettysburg and Germantown. It would be the west and north corner. Q. And what were the considerations that went into lo- cating that school there? A. Well, it was the site size. It was economic. So we had students who were across the street from Gettysburg, across the street from Carlson. We had quite a development going in the rear of Carlson School that abutted it. There was a possibility that the Veterans Administration would dis- pose of quite a bit of their land that was going into housing projects, and at one time plans were set up, but they did not crystallize. Part of the land was bought off or given to the University of Dayton for their west campus. But quite a bit of it did go into development. Q. And does the University of Dayton still own that land? A. They still own that land. They have some 75 acres there, I believe. 370 [R. I. 1790-1797, Vol. 18] Q. The next school that we have is Gardendale, and that is located where? A. That’s Gardendale, and that — Q. If you could, general locations, locating it for the rec- ord, please? A. It is west. On Western Avenue and Gettysburg. The west side of Gettysburg and what would be the extension of Western Avenue. Western Avenue wasn’t extended at that time. Q. And could you tell us what considerations went into locating that school there? A. Gardendale, one of the main considerations at the time of building Gardendale was the school wanted to develop a program to house all of its mentally retarded students who were at that time being housed in Orville Wright, which was on the opposite side of the city, and since all of those stu- dents were transported to the site, it didn’t matter too much the location of the school, since we transported them from all parts of the county, or of the city district, and a number of them came from out of the district. But the school was primari- ly developed for the mentally retarded, and then there was part of the Townview area in the back that was developing, and so additional rooms were added to that schoo! in order to make it some 20 to 23 rooms, I believe. Q. Was there ever any consideration or any fact given to the possible annexation of the school district into the Townview area? A. At one time there was a discussion of Townview coming into the school district. Townview would be where, what part? A. Right at that location. Q. Around here? A. That’s right. Q. A. 52) Which would be on the west of Gardendale? Yes. It adjoins the Gardendale School, abuts up against the school district. —P 371 Q. How many rooms were constructed for the mentally retarded? A. I believe there were eight rooms which were self- contained, that is, had their own toilet facilities, storage and everything else, plus they had utilization of the gymnasium facilities and the other special items, such as industrial arts, home ec areas. Q. Do you know why you had to place those children in a school in the Dayton System? A. I’m not sure. They had been with the school system for quite some time. The Board had taken on that responsi- bility. It may have been mandated by the State law, that we maintain and take care of them. Q. The next school that we have then is Hickorydale, and that was built when? A. Hickorydale was built in 1957, and that is south of the Belle Haven area. Q. And again to what part of the city? A. That’s in the western part of the city. The northwest part. It is between the Gettysburg and the Belle Haven area. That school was also built adjacent to some 40 acres of city park, and we have some 10 or 11 acres there that we developed. And did you give us the year that that was — 1957, I believe it was. That was the date of construction? Yes. And what other factors went into consideration of lo- cating Hickorydale? A. Well, the fact that students were there to relieve Belle Haven. That was primarily it. That and the fact that it was adjacent to the city location, but that area was developing all the way to the north and south of it, all the way up to the Hillcrest area and then going south toward what would be England, Queens Avenue and those streets that were de- veloped. Q. The next school that we have is Jackson Primary, and when was that built? (OF Oro 372 Jackson Primary was built in 1960. And that was’ — On the same site as the Jackson Elementary. And Jackson is located where? It’s in the west side of the city, southwest part. And why was it located where it was, on that site? Well, all of our primary schools are on the same site as the original building, the elementary part, and it would have been a matter of having to go out and pick another site that was out of the district, or not as centrally located. Many of the students, in the primary schools, they were brought to school by their older brothers and sisters who walked them to school, and so this would have been another problem of placing them in a different location. It was just an ideal location to put it in. Q. Was this located because of the students’ need there again? A. Yes. It shortened up the playground, which we were limited in, because of the street locations and the industrial site to the west and the railroad to the north, but we had made an attempt earlier to try to save the play area by putting it down in a certain corner of the site, but the long-range plans of the city is to have Route 35 come through there, and so we had to move it at the insistence of the city. Q. That would be the extension of Route 35, and it is now a four-lane highway on the eastern side of the city? A. Right. It stopped at the river, or just beyond the river. Q. And that is stopped as of now where? Where is it stopped? Well, it stops just beyond the interchange of 75 and 35. In other words, somewhere right around here? Right in that location. In this location? Right. . And there was plans for extending 35 westward? That's right. And it would come through down Home >rO>rOoro> ~ rPOrOPO> 373 Avenue and that area, so it was the city’s plan at that time that the possibility that the school would be in the wrong location, and they wanted us to move it, so they asked that we move it. So we redesigned it and relocated it. Q. The next school that we have is Jefferson, Jefferson Primary. That was constructed when? A. Jefferson Primary was constructed in 1967. That’s on the same site — it’s in the Daytonview area and it — Q. You will have to find exactly which part of the Dayton- view area we are talking about. A. The northwest area of the city. The immediate north- west, if you want to call it that. Just north of Wolfe Creek, which you have your pointer on there, and it would be Broad- way — not Broadway — I’m not sure what would be the right description of-it. Q. This was located where the elementary school was? A. That’s right. Located where the Jefferson Elementary school is, which was built in 1915 or 1916. Q. What year did you say this was constructed? A. 1967. Q. Now, what considerations went into locating this school] there? A. There was quite a bit of discussion held with the city about the possibility of acquiring land at the lower part of Jefferson District. Q. Excuse me. Where would that have been? A. That would have been south of the Jefferson School site, down here near what would be the Ferguson-Broadway area. Q. South of the — A. District. Q. South of the present location? A. Of the present location. It would be Oxford — some five or six blocks south of it. But the purpose of that was to — there was great need for recreational area in that district because of the fast increase 374 in the number of students, and so the city had in their long- range plans to acquire land, some eight to ten acres, near Broadway and Riverview and the Ferguson area, and we talked to them about the possibility of moving up their timetable and acquiring land that we could have built a school on with them, and we would acquire land along with their 10 acres, and we would have a decent site and a decent play area, because the present Jefferson site is kind of limited in area. Q. We are still talking about this proposed area? A. We wanted to build that school there, but there was quite a bit of public discussion about it and the feeling was that if we built the school there that since the trend of the black movement was north, that we would take a great num- ber of the blacks out of the Jefferson District and would whiten up the Jefferson Elementary School. So this wouldn’t be the thing to do, so the final.decision was to put the whole school on the same site rather than put the primary school at the lower level. Q. Then this site was located at the present elementary site? A. Right. On the present elementary site. We acquired some additional land there to try to relieve the loss of play area, but that had been a slow process because they are large homes and the development would have been extensive. [R. I. 1812-1814, Vol. 18] Let’s get back to the schools. The next school we have is Dunbar, and that was built when? A. That was built in 1962, and that is on Rich Avenue down here in the Miami Chapel area. Q. And why was that built? A. That was to relieve the Roosevelt area schooi, and there was certainly in the early considerations of that school some discussion to hold it or to build it along the Germantown area and to eliminate a lot of the substandard housing in that ait 375 area to try to put together a site of some 25 or 35 acres there, but the cost involved and the time that would have been spent in running down the absentee owners and vacating the streets and what have you, to get a decent size would have been prohibitive in cost, and then it came to our attention the land of Dr. Washington who had the acreage not too far south of it which we got 52 acres for quite considerably less and which had all of the facilities except for the streets already available; that is, sewer and water. Q. The next school that we have is Meadowdale which is located up on the same side as Meadowdale Elementary and that was built when? A. That was built in 1960. Q. And what considerations went into locating that school? A. Well, we acquired that land also along with the site to build the elementary and the area was developing. I forgot the name of the construction people, but we kept in close touch with them and we stated the areas that we wanted to use eventually for a high school and we acquired that. As a matter of fact, I think the developer had given the city something like three acres of ground and we used a park in that area which the city threw in to the School Board to be used as part of the site. That is our Fairview High School. Q. Now, the next one we have is Patterson, and that’s a co-operative school and that is located where? That is in Downtown Dayton. That was built when? 1952. That’s the co-op school. And where is that located did you say? That is at First and Sinclair. And why was that located in that particular area? That is where the old Patterson Parker High School was built and it was expanded and we bought land adjacent toit. Eventually we bought the whole block and expanded the high school. The vocational school serves all of the districts. Q. And finally the last one is Roth High School which is out on the far, far west side. POPP O > 376 A. That was built in 1959. Q. What considerations went into that? A. That was also a relief of high school students and to serve them in that area. We at one time discussed building the school on Third Street as a means of trying to get it closer to transportation, but difficulties developed and we found that land could be obtained in greater quantity and much less price at Hoover Avenue and Elmhurst or the Elmhurst extension, so we bought 30-some acres at that point and built the school there. Q. Now, there have been additions onto the existing build- ings, have there not? A. Right. What considerations went into determining what ad- ditions should be placed on buildings? A. Well, most of the additions were to serve the young- sters in their school district, and if the district increased in size, then we just added the additions to the school and we tried quite often to acquire additional ground to increase a site if it were possible, but if we were to try to build in a square, we would get into the problem of having a smaller school size perhaps since the additions in themselves wouldn't be worth putting a new school up * * ° [R. I. 1816, Vol. 18] Q. Mr. Bagwell, you came to the system in 1952? A. Right. Q. Did you teach or do anything else in the school system prior to this time? A. I acted as Superintendent in charge of the building in- spector for the City of Dayton prior to that. Q. Are you familiar with the standards for minimum site size recommended by the State for elementary schools? A. Iknow what the minimums were. They used to say five acres to start with and one acre for every hundred students. Q. There is a formula? A. Yes. 377 R. I. . ‘: ! eels ti Vol. 18] . Q. Are you also familiar with cmiieiae endations for minimum sizes and maximum sizes of ole rade that ma elementary school should have a sO many students and should — - certain number of students? eso eg ne ‘ ere are recommendations o» that Th ; ere . sonal feelings about what makes a large school or sm i. h a or ~~ school or bad school. eae - What are the recom j ini an element oo. oo for minimum size for a : pin ne sure I could give you what the educators say pet - 500 to 600 is a good school for the ele- i wih sod ee yet = I would probably want to 90 to at the most if it were ib re. oo it is not economically Ro ga seen Pe ut you wouldn't go below five or six hundred for te et pad high would you go for elementary? : > ad my druthers, I would probably like to say f r six hundred. With hindsight, I would say — ca * thle et ge ever sig with a problem where you it not to to t i i mee aa e size that it eventually went to A. idn’ aad < nae t have too much to do with the sizes that the 0. The recommendations sometimes were com- oy — a year and train them. } i i you make recommendations in connection with the cost of maint enance w sizes? hen the schools got over certain 378 A. Yes. I made recommendations, but it was — information that in the larger schools — well, in fact, in a cases, the larger the school, usually you had a greater per- centage of vandalism at it. | Q. Did you not in fact recommend against the location of certain schools and placing of units in particular seen because you know what would happen in terms of enrollmen and impaction in that area? A. I think the one that I readily recall I was against the location of was the Jefferson Primary School. [R. I. 1824-1826, Vol. 18] Q. Asa preliminary question, were you around when the schools were opened and did you see to it that everything was ready to start operation? A. Right. a Q. Did you attend the dedication ceremonies ? A. Not when I could get out of them . Q. But you were familiar and checked with the school when it was in operation to make sure it was within the warranties? A. Right. Q. po ies your attention now to the Belle Haven School which was in the northwest area — A. Right. Q. yo you aware that that school opened with a 100 ent white faculty? ge Right, although I would assume it would be because it was in that neighborhood at that time. Q. Now, the Carlson School, that opened with a 100 per- cent black faculty, did it not? . Well, if it didn’t, it was close to it. Eastmont, did it open with a 100 percent white faculty? Right. ck did it open with a 100 percent black faculty? No, white. rOPrPOr 379 Q. I am sorry, 100 percent white faculty, and that’s the one that you say a developer offered the School Board space, the free land if they would build a school in that area; correct? A. He offered the land that they could build a school on it if it would fit the needs of the school area; that is, if it was located in the site that would be adjacent to the youngsters. Q. Mr. Bagwell, are you familiar with the advertising for new subdivisions where they say new school to be built in this area and new church, new shopping center? A. Yes. Q. The developer in this case gave you how many acres? A. Twelve acres, I believe. Q. And when that school opened, it was a white school or black school? A. White school. Q. And white faculty? A. White faculty. THE COURT: Mr. Lucas, I will permit you to pursue this, it is cross-examination. I would observe that this issue has been really well-developed in this case. I am completely familiar with the position that the plaintiffs have taken, and you have well-documented it. I think there is no question that there were schools staffed by white faculties and schools staffed by black faculties, but it is also my understanding and it has been well documented that at a point in time this was specifically changed. Now, referring to my original state- ment, I will permit you to go forward. I really don’t see the pertinence at this point in the case of spending time on that issue. MR.LUCAS: Your Honor, as understand, the evidence was presented that the schools were built where children were and we understand arguments flow from that and we are trying to show the school was identified wherever it was built by its faculty. THE COURT: All right. 380 [R. I. 1828-1829, Vol. 18] Q. The Hickorydale, where is that located? Is that to the west? A. That’s in the west and northwest areas, just south of Belle Haven School District. It is along the Wolfe Creek side. Q. How large a school is that? A. I don’t know what it is at this point. It was at one time something like 30 or 35 classrooms, so it could have been seven or eight or nine-hundred. Q. In 1972 enrollment indicates that there are only 475 pupils in that school. Was there a fire or anything else that happened to the building? A. No. One of the things that might have affected the enrollment in many of these schools is the fact that they are getting into programs that will take more of the space for any number of things. It could have been reduced classroom size. When I started with the system there was 35 in the class- room. That’s the average. And over the years they reduced it down to something less than 30, 28, 27, in that area, which would affect the kind of enrollment you have also. But they have also several programs housing some of the school areas. Part of the area may have been taken up by development of the cafeterias, which until after I left the school system, we did not have cafeterias except in the high schools and in the special schools. Q. Do you know whether any of that took place in Hickorydale? A. I couldn’t tell you that. Q. You don’t know? A. No. I know a cafeteria took part of it, but that may have been just the gymnasium and some other areas. Q. Were there 35 classrooms there? A. I don't know that. Hickorydale? Q. Yes. A. It says 14 — no. Q. Pardon? 381 A. Fourteen classroom, and then eight, so it’s 22. 4 I. 1848, Vol. 18] A. Right. - And so instead you built additions i ti 32 5 sina particular area hd a "gen the problem of boundary adjustment, Q. Would you agree that in eff Id ect then, when you add — put a addition to a school, that as far as that obit is con- cerned, you determine the boundaries and they are coextensive with the origi ; aaa boundaries of the school? Is that a fair A. I would say so. Q. Pardon? A. Yes. Q. All right. So that if a school i ol is already 100 percent ye and you are making an addition to that seid a in effect have determined the boundaries to be that creatin a hundred percent black school unit? , A. That's right, in most cases it was. Q. Allright. And for those primaries that opened a hun- dred percent black or white, th ves alll thieee tenus attache? , the same would be true, although A. Right. em bt ? tee i Vol. 18] A. Right. I would assume any- & 1 would say on the percentages of the faculty would be — I i vl would tend to agree with you because I don’t know aes Riad lee For being in the area it was and the policy the Board followed, I would assume there would be black student body and black staff. : Q. Did the Roth and Meadowdale planning go on at approximately th i one y the same time? Meadowdale was opened 382 A. About 10 or 12 years ago. Let’s see, Meadowdale here is listed as 1960. Q. And Roth was opened when? A. In 1959, the year before, so construction would have been underway and Meadowdale and Roth and Dunbar prob- ably would all have some construction or planning going on at the same time. And Belmont was what year? 1952-53, that year. Was there an addition to Belmont High School? Yes, there was. What year? Probably 1966, somewhere in there. POrPOre Would you hand the witness Exhibit C? Would you look under the school Shoup Mill, please? All right. . And for the year 1968-69, how many students were enrolled at that school? A. 365. Q. And under Valerie for the year 1969-70, how many were enrolled in that school? A. 1969-70, 486. Q. Then, going to one other question that was asked you on this transportation across the railroad tracks, you indicated that that was a matter of no access there. "A. That’s right. I believe that I can readily recall it was a Grant School District in which there were students east of the railroad and the Board used to transport them back and forth, but when the access was developed across there, that transportation was eliminated. OFrO” 383 Y. TESTIMONY OF RALPH CURK. [R. I. 1864-1879, Vol. 18] Q. Could you give us your name, sir? Ralph Curk. Where do you live? 7210 Noretta Court. What is your present occupation, Mr. Curk? Retired. And from what are you retired? Director of Research of the Dayton Board of Education. . (Can you give us the history of your association with the Dayton School System as a student teacher or member of the Administration? A. Well, it started as kindergarten student at Edison School through seventh grade at Edison, grade 8 at Weaver, grade 9 at Parker, graduated from Stivers High School, got my Bachelor of Science Degree at Indiana Central University and came back to Dayton as a teacher in 1928. I was a teacher at Clear- view for three years and went to Roosevelt for three years, was Director of Research for 18 years, and retired in June, 1968. Q. What subject matter did you teach at Roosevelt, Mr. Curk? A. General science and chemistry. Q. Were you involved in any administrative duties in addi- tion to your teaching duties there? A. Well, I wouldn’t consider them administrative. I was a student counselor. Q. When did you leave Roosevelt and go to the Central Office as Director of Research? A. 1950. Q. And when did you retire from that position? A. 1968. . Can you tell us what your duties were as Director of Research for the Dayton School System? A. Well, primarily it had to do with the budget, estimating OPrOroro> 384 the tax duplicate and the financial revenues, projecting the expenditures over a period of years anticipating the size of operating levies that the School Board might have to ask the voters to supply, the analysis of the census, projecting school enrollments, projecting the need for a staff and, well, I suppose anything financial eventually found its way over my desk whether I was directly involved in it or indirectly involved in it. ‘2. What individuals and positions comprised the Execu- tive Staff of the Dayton School Administration during this 18-year period that you were associated with them? A. We were very fortunate in our Superintendent as being a true executive, and he would have staff meetings consisting of the three Assistant Superintendents, the Director of Pupil Personnel, the Clerk Treasurer, and myself on the staff. Q. Can you identify the individuals that filled the staff positions during that 18-year period? A. The Assistant Superintendent in charge of curriculum was Dr. Howard Boda, the Assistant Superintendent in charge of Staff Personnel was Homer Royer, and when I first went down, the Assistant Superintendent in charge of Business was Frank Carlson and replaced by Mason Bagwell, and the Di- rector of Pupil Personnel was Harold Armstrong who later retired and was replaced by Mr. Goff. Q. When did Mr. Goff assume that position? A. I think it was in 1964. Q. Does that cover the group? A. And did I mention the Clerk Treasurer? He always sat in on the staff meeting. Q. Who was the Superintendent of the System during this period? A. Mr. Robert French. Q. Is he associated with the School System at the present time? A. He is a member of the Board of Education? Q. As part of your administrative duties during this 18- year period, were you consulted with respect to the drawing of attendance and optional zones, Mr. Curk? 385 A. Quite often Mr. Armstrong would have a problem, and since I was involved in anticipating enrollments in various areas, he would come up and consult with me. We would go out and drive the area, examine it for hazards, accessibility, distance, and get a feel for the problems as presented to him at that time. Then, he would from that observation and dis- cussion between he and I come up with a recommendation to the staff, and then in staff meeting we would have a chance to tear it apart and cuss and discuss it and then Mr. French along with Mr. Armstrong would have the recommendation for the Board. . Q. Did your same practice continue after Mr. Armstrong was replaced by Dr. Goff in 1964? A. Not to the same extent, but the inter-offce communi- cation of these problems and their recommendation, I was always notified of that. Q. Were you retained by the Dayton Board of Education in connection with this lawsuit, Mr. Curk? A. Yes, sir. Q. And what have you done in connection with this case? A. Well, after four and a half years, I had forgotten quite a bit. So, in order to refamiliarize myself with some of the things that happened in those years, I went back to the Board and, of course, after four and half years my files were defunct. So I went down to the attendance department and asked for copies of the monthly enrollment in October. The first two weeks, and I understand now it is the first week in October, is used as a basis of reporting to the State Department for the foundation program. So, I got copies of the enrollment from, I think it is, 1941, and I didn’t have time to complete it, but it did give me the attendance pattern of the schools. I went over the exhibit that Mr. Krebs supplied for me that had the building information on it and also went to the vault where all the minutes of the Board of Education were kept, and I used the index to look up items of schools that I had forgotten about, boundaries and boundary changes and things of that 386 nature that were a matter of record in the Board of Education minutes to refresh my memory. Q. Now, your deposition was taken in this case on Octo- ber 24, was it not? : A. I think that was the date. Q. At that time had you completed your study and analysis that you have described to us? A. I have refamiliarized myself with a lot more since then. Q. How long before your deposition had you actually been retained in this case? A. I don’t remember. I know the Board met on Thursday night and it was at that meeting that I was retained and Mr. Krebs called me to come down on Friday, and he outlined schedually what he would like for me to do to assist in this matter, and I think it was the following Tuesday. So, I probably had about a week and two days since to go back over some of the things that had happened while I was down there before the deposition. Q. During your period of tenure with the Dayton School System, what was the practice of the systeza with respect to distribution of supplies to the various schools? A. Well, it is always on a per pupil basis. Again, I used the October report, the special report to determine the en- rollment in each individual school, the kindergarten enroll- ment, the special education enrollment, the industrial arts enrollment, the home economics enrollment and all of that, and each one of those had a specific rate or amount of money that was multiplied by the number of pupils in the particular building, and that was compiled and given to the purchasing department. Q. You may complete your answer, Mr. Curk. A. I need to have part of it read back to see where I was. A. And the purchasing department would notify the principal or the responsible person in the representative build- ings and that would be the basis for expenditure of the next year’s budget. 387 Q. All right. Was the practice the same with respect to each school in the system? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were there ever any junior high schools in the Dayton School System? A. The junior high program started, oh, in the middle or late twenties, I think maybe 1925 or 1967, and then in the middle or late thirties Dr. Oley from the Ohio State University headed up a survey commission. I forget the title of it, but the sum and substance and result of that was a recommendation that the Dayton Board of Education eliminate its junior high school and go from a 1 through 8 and 9 through 12 organi- zation. Q. Was that recommendation accepted? A. It was accepted and the junior high school was elim- inated in September 1940. Q. After the elimination of the junior high school in 1940 were there ever instances where 7th and 8th graders were assigned to specific high schools? A. Quite often. Q. What were the reasons for that and when did it occur? A. The reasons for it would be overcrowding in the ele- mentary buildings, and it would be a temporary condition until arrangements could be made to provide classroom space to accommodate them in their own building or maybe a new building constructed. Q. Can you tell me what high schools in the system were affected by this? A. Well, Dunbar, Roosevelt, Kiser, Colonel White, and Stivers. I am not sure of Belmont and Wilbur Wright, whether they ever had 8th graders or 7th and 8th graders. I would have to check my records on that, and I don’t know if they are complete enough to give me that information. Q. There has been some evidence here concerning assign- ment of the 7th and 8th graders from Garfield or Willard Schools to Dunbar in the early ’40’s, I believe 1942. Do you 388 have any records to indicate what the situation was on assignment of students throughout the system at that time? A. Well, when I took my attendance patterns and copied them off from the child accounting record, and that was one of the reasons I did it, to get a feel for this, and there was evidence I think, if my memory serves me correctly, that in 1942, the year in question, Roosevelt and Kiser, I think, either Kiser or Colonel White, I think there are two other schools other than Dunbar that housed 8th graders or 7th and 8th graders. Q. Mr. Curk, with respect to Garfield, or Willard students who received temporary assignments in the 7th or 8th grade to Dunbar High School, can you tell us whether those students retained the option of going on to Dunbar or Roosevelt High School after completing their 8th grade education? A. Yes, they would have. Q. Are you familiar, Mr. Curk, with the boundary changes affecting Garfield, Willard, and Wogaman that were adopted by the Board in December of 1952? A. Yes, I am. Q. And can you tell us the circumstances leading up to those changes and what was done? A. Iam not sure whether it is 1952 or 1953 or when it was, but Mr. French called Representative leaders of the various west side organizations in for a conference, and he explained to them what we had planned to do in our building program to provide school facilities for the mushrooming school en- rollment and said that we can do one of two things. We can enlarge Garfield and Willard the same as we are doing for all the other buildings in the city, or we can shrink those boundaries and not add onto those buildings to take care of the increased density of population would allow some of the students in the periphery of those respective districts to attend integrated school systems, such school districts as Edison, Irving, and Whittier and so on. * ° ni ot rt 389 Q. And what plan was actually adopted by the Board that you referred to? A. Well, I think it was Plan B they recognized the oppor- tunity and elected Plan B, and that was what was recom- mended to the Board, and that was the plan adopted. Q. And just so the record will be clear, which plan was the B plan? A. That was to shrink the boundaries around Garfield and Willard, and add what was taken away to the peripheral schools, to increase the enrollment pattern at the integrated schools. Q. In the establishment of the Roth High School attend- ance zone in 1959, was race taken into consideration? A. No, sir, it was not, Q. At the time the attendance zone was established, were you asked to make any survey as to the race of the prospective students at Roth High School? A. I evidently was. I don’t remember the circumstances. But I was shown a report that I had made and it was a guessti- mate more than anything else, because looking from the map and estimating that a hundred percent of the school would be feeding into Roth, and a hundred percent of this school, or 75 percent, or 80 percent, or 20 percent, whatever the case might be, and then applying that percentage to the guess of the enrollment pattern of the respective schools involved, I came up with an estimate that I thought that the Roth High School might open with a certain percentage of black students. Q. And in addition to your check of the races of potential students in connection with Roth, were you also requested to compile information concerning racial distributions of stu- dents in the year before the Garfield-Willard and Wogaman boundary changes? A. There again is one that I have forgotten. In the day of my deposition, I think I was asked a similar question, and I said definitely not. That day at lunch Mr. Krebs just showed me an exhibit that he had received, and I said I wonder 390 where that came from, because the way it is dated I would have done it, and I don’t remember it. And then later on, at the Board of Education offices, a member of the staff said here’s a little goodie that you might remember, there’s a worksheet, so I will have to admit that I did prepare the study and while the complete report wasn’t on the exhibit, it was just excerpts from it, I suppose that’s all that was left, but it seems for, I think it was a five-year period, starting in 1947 and ending in ’51-’52, at that time the princi- pals reported at the end of the year — one of the questions on the principals’ report to the State Department was the number of Negros enrolled in that particular school that par- ticular year. Now, I have inferred from the reading of the excerpts that that evidently was my source of information, and I think I commented at the time that it was not reliable because it didn’t represent the actual black enrollment at any one day, but the gross enrollment for that particular school year. So that part of my deposition to the counsel, To Mr. Diamond, I was in error, but I was not aware of it at the time. Q. Except for these isolated incidents, in 1952, and then in connection with the Roth guesstimate in 1959, did you ever compile or maintain any statistics concerning the race of students in the system during your 18 years as Director of Research? A. No. We were not conscious of that, at least I wasn’t, because at that time it was madatory that we take the census enumeration each May for all of the school-aged children from five through seventeen. Well, we asked our census enumerators to include anybody born in May at the time that they took the house to house contact, and so we had it from birth through seventeen. The only information that involved us too much in our projected enrollment figures was the number of parochial students. Now, we were allowed to ask — the enumerators were al- 391 lowed to ask if they were going to send their children to parochial schools or to public schools. So that final tabulation for each school district would indi- cate to me the number that were attending public schools and the number attending parochial schools, and that the the inti- mation that I used to develop the survival rate or experience formula for each school district in the projected enrollment. Race was not involved. Q. Did you have anything to do with the Ohio Civil Rights Commission student surveys that were made in 1963 and subsequent years? A. No, I did not. Q. Except for the 1952 attempt to provide more interracial experiences by shrinking the boundaries of certain black ele- mentary schools, did the race of potential students ever play any role in the setting of attendance or optional zones in the Dayton School System? A. No, sir, it did not. Q. What factors were taken into consideration in fixing attendance and optional zones? A. Well, I suppose the prime factor would be availability of space and then the next would be the distance factor. Any hazards that would be present, going to and from school, and accessibility. I think those four would be the major factors that we took into consideration. [R. I. 1882-1897, Vol. 18] Q. All right. Let’s move to this eastward path. The next one we would encounter would be the Roosevelt-Colonel White optional area, would it not? A. That's right. 7 Q. Most of that option was originally established in 1951, as I understand it, is that correct? A. Yes. It was a change in the original high school boundary between the Fairview-White complex and Roose- velt. The original boundary was at Oxford Avenue, extending 392 from Salem over to a point west of Philadelphia. And “0 this optional area in 1951 came along and went from iene to Lexington to Grand and Superior. So there are t - blocks north and south that extended from Salem Avenue to Rosedale. Salem Avenue on the east side? That’s right. And can you give me the other one? Superior Avenue on the south. . Allright. This would be Superior Avenue running east- est to what is now the complete area? ok I would assume that is Superior. That is the general location of it, yes, sir. Q. All right. Then it went where? A. To Rosedale. Q. All right. A. And then south on Rosedale to Riverview. Just one line there. . Q. And then where on Riverview? | ae A. And then west and northwest on Riverview to I t in it’s pretty close to what used to be called Bessie Little Bridge, or Alcott Avenue came down there, so the extension of Alcott to Wolfe Creek, and then up to Athens, north to Athens, and then east on Athens to Philadelphia, south on Philadelphia to Oxford, and east on Oxford to point of beginning. ; Q. In what attendance zonc had that area been prior to the creation of this option in 1951? A. Roosevelt. Has Q. How long had it been in Roosevelt district? A. Well, the original was 1940. This is ’51. It would be Bo was the reason for setting up the optional zone in 1951? A. Well, this was a little unusual. / If you will remember, one of our factors in setting up OFroreo 393 boundaries was distance, and here we are attempting to have a point equidistant from one campus to a split campus. So at the time that was done, they had to consider both of the distance to the Colonel White area, which housed 9th and 10th grades, and also the distance to the Fairview build- ing, which housed 11th and 12th grades. So that was a little difficult to do. And then as the transportation pattern and city transit changed and we were in the process of our building program to give relief to various buildings, they decided to make this an optional area, and while doing so they had to make it as fair for those 9th and 10th graders, and also include the 11th and 12th graders. So that was the reason, I think, for the extension, clear to the west side. Because as you know, as it goes west, the accessibility to Fairview increases because it is directly up Philadelphia Drive, and I don’t know exactly where the gasoline bus made its loop. I think it was around Cornell, but it might have been far- ther north, up around Otterbein. I’m not sure. But there was a gasoline bus which facilitated transporta- tion on Philadelphia, the same as the city transit change trans- portation on Salem Avenue. THE COURT: Mr. Curk, why should this not have been transferred to the Colonel White-Fairview District? Why make it an optional zone? THE WITNESS: Well, Your Honor, I think it dates back to — when 1940 came along, prior to that time to my know- ledge there were no high school boundaries. For years any- body in Dayton had a choice between Steel and Stivers. And then Roosevelt came along in the ’20’s and I’m not aware of any hard lines being drawn in the ’20’s. So we had a choice of three high schools. And then when the junior high school program was elim- inated and some of these junior high school buildings were converted to high school complexes, it was decided then to make hard lines between these high schools that were then 394 in existence, and I think that is the first time they ever attempted it, and they had quite a period of resisting change. THE COURT: What date was this that these lines were drawn? THE WITNESS: 1940. THE COURT: This is now 11 years later? THE WITNESS: Yes. . THE COURT: Why would there be an optional zone created 11 years after you have set up boundary lines? THE WITNESS: Well, the original lines was again an attempt, I think, to equate the distance between these two complexes and Roosevelt, and if you looked at the eastern side of this optional zone and compare it with Fairview, it is farther, much farther to Fairview than it is to Roosevelt, but yet if you compare the distance from that eastern line to Colonel White, it is much closer than it is to Roosevelt. And then as you go westward, the distance factor changes. So whether that is sufficient reason for not doing it, Your Honor, I don’t know but I’m positive that that was part of the consideration. THE COURT: Do you have any record, or is there any record of requests that this be made optional for those students who would otherwise go to Roosevelt? THE WITNESS: Yes, it is a matter of record. You sec, your Honor, I just happened to live three doors south of Oxford when I was teaching at Roosevelt, when this change was made, and just two doors from me there was a child who tried to give a false address so that he would be in the Fairview District instead of the Roosevelt District, and that was quite common. There was a great deal of pressure and requests to the Board to change the boundaries to suit one or more of their conveniences. And this was resisted, as I say, until 1951, when the transportation pattern, the city transit pattern had changed, and the accessibility was a factor that had greater impact, I think, on the decision than the lack of it before. 395 THE COURT: And if I understand your answer correctly, this is really a matter of convenience and only that? THE WITNESS: I think it was, sir, yes, sir. THE COURT: Was there anything else? THE WITNESS: To my knowledge, no, nothing else was considered. THE COURT: No. I’m not talking of the convenience of the students only. It was the convenience of the parents and convenience of the Board, is that correct? THE WITNESS: Well, I don’t know how to answer con- venience to the Board. THE COURT: Well, if there were pressures both ways, this is a political body, and political bodies are amenable to pres- sure. THE WITNESS: So if they succumb, well, it is a greater convenience to them, I would agree. THE COURT: You may proceed, Mr. Greer. Q. In setting up this optional area in 1951, or any of the other optional areas, setting them up in this manner instead of changing hard boundaries, were previous patterns of attend- ance taken into consideration? A. Well, I think that’s generally true and accepted, that once a child has been in a school, the older children coming along have a tendency to want to attend the same school. Also, if they are attending an elementary school that happens to be divided between two high schools, and their friends are going to one and they are going to another, there is a reluctance to accept that. So in that context, I think you are correct. The attendance pattern does influence some of these desires. Q. Now, if we leave out Fairview High School for a minute and just consider access from this area to Roosevelt or to Colonel White, what can you tell us about the physical charac- teristics of the area as they reflect on access to those two schools? A. Well, we had a bridge across Wolf Creek at Summit Street. There is a bridge across Wolf Creek at Rosedale, which is in about the center of the optional area, and there is a bridge 396 across Wolf Creek at, as I referred to, the end of Riverview, the Bessie Little Bridge. So those three streets would have to be their main approaches from this area north of Little Creek to Rosedale. Now, Rosedale I am very familiar with because that was my path when I taught at Roosevelt. On the west side of Rosedale, it was occupied by the Dayton Tire and Rubber Company. Their plant was not adjacent to Rosedale, and in the years before they expanded, this was just an open field and not utilized as a parking lot as it is now. The area on the east side of Rosedale, between the railroad and Western Avenue, was sort of a holding yard for the packing company in there that was located at the corner of Rosedale and Western, and then the Pennsylvania Railroad, was directly, oh, I would say within one city block south of Riverview, and on the west side it served the Dayton Tire and Rubber Company and its switch yards, on the east side there were a number of coal yards between the railroad and Riverview, and down close to Summit Street was a large company, Simmons, Board and White. . Does that answer your question? Is that what you have in mind? Q. That answers me on the southern end. What physical factors are there that would have some bear- ing on access at the north, as far as students in that area going up towards Colonel White? A. Well, I don’t know of any. Of course, Salem Avenue was the main artery through there, but there were many connecting streets that would allow these people to move north to Colonel White, many connecting streets and cross streets. I don’t think there were any physical barriers on the north side, between this area and Colonel White. Q. As I understand it, the problem really was not access to Colonel White, but following on to Fairview High School after the completion of Colonel White. 397 A. There again, it was a distance factor that was added onto it. Q. And you indicated about the change in the patterns of the City Transit Bus Company. What, in 1951, were the public transportation patterns from this area to the vicinity of Fairview High School? A. Well, I don’t know the exact year that it changed, but in the early years the City Transit had a line that crossed the Main Street bridge, the Miami River, Main Street bridge, turned up River Road, up Forest Grove, up Forest Grove to Neil, Five Oaks, went up Five Oaks, or down Five Oaks, over to Salem Avenue, and up Salem to Catauqua Drive where it made its loop. And then there was a line on Salem Avenue — Q. First of all, the east end of this optional zone was on Salem Avenue, is that right? A. That's correct, and this bus facility going up to Colonel White or past — relatively past Colonel White went out to Fairview, would come out on Salem, maybe four or five blocks north of Oxford Avenue, before it hit Salem. But there was another line on Salem Avenue that looped around Salem and north, which was south of the northern part of this boundary, and then those lines were consolidated, and the line that traversed Salem Avenue from north-southward was combined with the other line and went out to Catauqua, up Catauqua, and as I understand it, I think it now loops around Catauqua, Hillcrest, Philadelphia and back on Salem. Q. All right. If we look to the west side of the option, which went down to Riverview, what was its access situation? A. Well, as I mentioned, this gasoline bus — and of course, I was familiar with the bus coming down Philadelphia and going down Riverview to Salem Avenue, and then crossing the bridge there and going on downtown, but the exact north- ern culmination or loop of that gasoline bus I am not quite sure of, whether it is on Otterbein or where it was. Q. What about the access from this area in 1951 by public transportation to Roosevelt? 398 A. Well, there was no crosstown public transportation. If the students elected to use public transportation to get to Roosevelt, they would have to use either the Salem Avenue line or the gasoline bus, go downtown and transfer to the Third Street line and go west on Third Street to Roosevelt. Q. Now, this optional area was later expanded to its present form, was it not? A. Yes, sir. Q. When was that done, why, and what was involved? A. Well, by 1959, I think, was the first graduating class from Colonel White. So the Fairview-White complex was divided, I think, in 1955, 54 or °55. Q. If you want to refer to any notes that you may have, why feel free to do so, Mr. Curk. A. Well, if that date is important, I'll try to do it. My note here says 12-4-58, when the boundary line was changed. So the concept of the four-year high school at Fairview and the four year high school at Colonel White would be effective in the ’57-58 school year, when Colonel White would have its first juniors and then in ’58-59 it had its first seniors and first graduating class. THE COURT: Mr. Curk, this has been referred to as the Colonel White-Roosevelt optional zone. Do I understand that after 1958 this was a three-way optional zone, also including Fairview, or was it limited to Colonel White and Roosevelt? THE WITNESS: No. It was a three-way option, between Colonel White and Fairview — I mean Colonel White and Roosevelt, and Fairview and Roosevelt. The line between the Fairview and Colonel White was drawn so that Philadelphia, the lower part of Philadelphia, was still a part of Colonel White area, and it came up to, I think it was Otterbein Avenue, and then extended east. THE COURT: I’m not interested really in the specifics. All I want to know is do I understand that any student living in that area could have chosen one of those three schools? 399 THE WITNESS: No. They could have chosen Fairview and Roosevelt, on the west side. THE COURT: Do I understand that this is really two optional areas? THE WITNESS: Two optional areas. THE COURT: All right. Roosevelt versus Fairview and Roosevelt versus Colonel White. It was not a three-way option? THE WITNESS: Not a three-way option, no. Q. What was involved in the change that was made along about the time that Colonel White became a four-year high school? A. Well, the area bounded by the east by Salem Avenue was moved southward from Superior to Riverview and on down to Wolfe Creek. Now, Superior to Riverview is a long square, and Riverview to Wolf Creek is a short square and that extended over to Rosedale, which was the beginning of the former optional area. So it was bounded on the east by Salem Avenue, on the west by Rosedale, on the north by Superior, and on the south by Willard. [R. I. 1898-1899, Vol. 18] Q. Let’s proceed on east to the Kiser-Colonel White option, which I understand was estab- lished in 1962. What can you tell us concerning that optional area? A. My memory is faulty there, Mr. Greer. I don’t remem- ber that. I’m sure that it was considered at staff, brought up at Staff and discussed, but I have no recollection of it at all. Q. In reviewing the records of the Board, what can you tell us about the racial characteristics of the students at each of those schools in 1962, when the option was created? A. Well, we have no record for 1962. The closest record we have would be the 1963 Ohio Survey and at that time Kiser was 2.7 and Colonel White was 1.1 percent black. 400 Q. And what can you tell us about the capacities of the two schools at the time this option was created? A. Kiser was one of those schools that was a combination junior high school-high school. In other words, at one time it housed the 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th and 11th grades, back in the mid-thirties and then it was converted to a high school and its attendance zone traditionally has not been as densely popu- lated as the other attendance zones or the other high schools in the city. So I would assume that the capacity of Kiser, there was always available space there, and enrollment would be low after the junior high days. Q. Was this optional zone taken out of the old Kiser at- tendance zone or out of the old Colonel White attendance zone? A. Out of the Colonel White attendance zone. Q. All right. Let’s move on then to the last of the four high school optional areas, which is an area on the east side of Dayton between Wilbur Wright and Belmont, is it not? [R. I. 1904-1918, Vol. 19] Let’s start with the optional area that exists between Belle Haven School and Ft. McKinley School. Can you tell us when that was created and why it was not created with hard lines? A. It was created in 1955, and there were two factors in- volved in that. One was accessibility and the other was hazards. Q. What were the accessibility and hazard factors involved? A. Well, the streets could not have openings to the east to Salem Aveune which would involve the accessibility, and, of course, Salem Avenue is a major artery and would offer a hardship factor or hazard factor. Q. The next optional area if we start at this same end of 401 the map and work our way east would be the two optional areas that presently exist between Residence Park and Jane Addams. Can you tell us when they were created and why they weren’t drawn with hard lines? A. In September of 1959, the large one in particular, the entrance to this residential area is off of Hoover Avenue and had no access to the south to Jane Addams School, and in order to exit from this area, they are actually closer to Residence Park before they can continue on their way to Jane Addams, so it is an accessibility factor. The little one square block is about as equadistant as you can get. Q. As to the Belle Haven-Ft. McKinley and the larger Jane Addams Residence Park optional areas, was there any consid- eration given to potential development? A. Well, I think the way districts were drawn was with anticipation of future residential development to open up accessibility, and after that had materialized, it would logically belong in that particular attendance zone. Q. Do you know whether the development that was antici- pated in those small areas actually has come about? A. Well, to my knowledge, neither one had developed to the point in the Belle Haven-Ft. McKinley, to the east of Ft. McKinley or to the south to Jane Addams. Q. Going further east, then, to the next optional area which is an optional area between Westwood Elementary School and Jackson Elementary, can you tell us when that option was created and why it was drawn other than by hard lines? A. That was in 1952, and again the area is about as equa- distant as you can get between Jackson and Westwood, and it was changed to an option area because of the hazard of the young children crossing Third Street which is a main east-west artery through the city, carrying not only the city traffic, but U. S. 35 traffic. Q. Was there anything distinctive about the way that op- tion operated with respect to classes in either school? A. Yes. This was an unusual situation because of the 402 hazard. It developed that in 1952, the first year that it was in operation, it involved only kindergarten through grade 3. Then, each subsequent year another grade level was added. In other words, the third grader that had optioned to Westwood would remain there for the fourth grade and the following year for the fifth grade and so on, so it was progressive upward by grade level in successive years. Q. Which way did the option run? A. It was originally part of Jackson and was optioned to Westwood and I think the records from the Board minutes will show that later on it was changed and made a part of West- wood with an option to Jackson. : Q. Continuing east through the city and crossing the river, the next one we come to is an optional area between Lincoln and Horace Mann Elementary Schools, is it not? A. Yes. That area was made optional in 1957 and again by the request of parents, and it probably would be farther to Horace Mann than to Lincoln, but yet it is an area right at the intersection of Wayne and Wilmington Avenue, and Wil- mington Avenue would be a direct route to Horace Mann. To get to Lincoln, they would have to wind in and out and turn course, so directness and the fact it was practically equa- distant would be involved. Q. The next optional area as we move east is between Cleveland and Belmont Schools, is it not? A. Yes. That is a triangular effect. It is an area between Watervalete on the south and Wayne Avenue on the north, and Watervalete probably has greater traffic than Wayne Ave- nue, but they were trying to encourage the youngsters to go to Belmont, but they had the option of going to Cleveland if they so desired, but either way they had to cross a main thorough- fare. Q. What was the reason for not making that an area in one or the other district with hard lines? A. I think the attendance pattern there probably was the major factor or convenience to the people living in the area —ee ->- a + eae ee 403 and using the criteria to determine a hard line, it probably wasn't there, no justification to say this is that much closer or that much farther and so on. Q. Continuing then to the east, the next optional area would be one between Grand and Belmont Eelementary School, would it not? A. Yes. That area again, the distance factor is probably about the same between the two schools and again it was con- venient to the parents in the area with not justification to refuse their request. Q. And finally we have an optional area between Lewton School and Eastmont, I believe, isn’t it? A. This was an unusualssituation in that it involved two principal streets, Quimby Lane and Shafer Road, that exited to the north on Xenia Avenue, or U.S. 35 and they were not completed to the south, so that they would access to the Eastmont School. So they would have to exit from this area to the north and then go either east or west, east of Lewton or west to Eastmont, or vice versa. Excuse me. West to Lewton and east to Eastmont. Q. Is that Eastmont and Kemp? A. Eastmont and Kemp. Not Eastmont and Lewton. This isn’t Quimby Lane then. Well, even so the people in this area here have — excuse me. I should stand on the other side. The people in this area here would have to go around this way and there is no exit from this residential pattern to Eastmont. These people can come across this way. These people have no access to this except going in and around about way. There is Woodman Drive, which recently is a very highly traveled street. That formerly had not been cut through. But now that is cut through and it is almost like a peripheral highway. 404 So I would say there it would be two factors: Hazard and accessibility. Q. Now, if we recede into the past during your tenure with the School Board, there were at least up until 1969 when the Stivers boundary changed, two other optional high school areas were there not, between Stivers and Wilbur Wright and Stivers and Belmont? A. Yes, sir. Q. And can you tell me when those options were created and why they were not created with hard lines? A. Well, they were created in 1956 with the opening of Belmont, and the Belmont area relieved the Stivers School Dis- trict more than Wilbur Wright, and the optional area between Stivers and Belmont was at the extreme south and accessibility to either of the schools was difficult. Q. Let's go to elementary schools prior to 1972, and during the period that you were with the School Board, there was at one time an optional area between Fort McKinley and Fair port, was there not? A. Yes, sir, and that was two factors involved in that: Accessibility and hazards. Q. What were the nature of the accessibility and hazard problems that caused that to be drawn as an optional area? A. The difficulty to getting to Salem Avenue on the east. They would probably have to go west to Gettysburg, and the crossing at Gettysburg and Salem Avenue is quite a difficult crossing. Q. At one time there was also an optional area between Fairport and Fairview Elementary Schools, was there not? A. Yes. That was part of Fairview, made optional to Fair- port. Again it was the Salem Avenue traffic hazard. Q. What was the date that that was created? A. Ihave 1960. Q. Now, at one time there were two options, were there not, between Fairport and Cornell Heights? 405 A. Yes. Again it was in 1960, and this was new residential development where accessibility was definitely a factor, be- cause there were not through streets and it was hoped that eventually development would continue those streets so that there would be more direct access. Q. At one time there was an optional zone between Jefferson and Cornell Heights, was there not? A. The only difficulty there was that these two squares south of Cornell were about three blocks long. It was between Princeton Park and Cornell, and on Oxford Avenue to the south — the first through street south of Princeton Park, and it extended from Everett Drive to Vernon Place to Windsor to Rosedale. But these three very long blocks north of Prince- ton Park had no dividing line between them in order to make them equidistant. There is no natural line. You just have to follow maybe a property line on this side of the street and a property line on the other side. So since it was a distance almost equidistant, it was made an optional area. Q. What about an optional area that existed between Jeffer- son and Brown at one time? What was the reason that was made and why was it made without hard lines? A. Well, there again it was a crossing at Cornell and Salem Avenues. That was a hazardous crossing. Q. What about the optional zone that formerly existed between Jefferson and Edison? A. This area involved the — again, I shouldn’t take time to name streets, but it was about equidistant and more direct to Jefferson and more roundabout crossing the railroads and so on to Edison. Q. What about the optional area that once existed be- tween Westwood and Gardendale? When was that created? A. That was in 1957. Q. What was the reason for drawing that as an optional area rather than with hard lines? A. Well, this was one of those unusual situations where the boundary line was drawn close to Westwood in order to give it as much relief as possible, but also recognizing that 406 Gettysburg Avenue, which they would have to cross to get to Gardendale School, was a four-lane highway. Q. Were there any other access factors in that area between the optional area and Gardendale School? A. Well, they weren’t insurmountable, because they were so close to the school, even though they had to wind their way around to get there, it wouldn’t have caused that much extra distance. Q. What about an optional area that formerly existed between Residence Park and Jackson for students at the Veterans Administration? A. The north boundary of the Veterans Administration was Third Street, which was the south boundary of Residence Park. The east boundary of the Veterans Administration was the west boundary of Jackson. And I think it was in 1951, the Board of Education passed a resolution that if there were elementary school children residing with their parents on this facility they would have the option to Residence Park or Jackson. Q. Was there formerly an option betwee - nS Abed y p n Greene and Gar A. Greene and Garfield? Q. Yes. A. I'm not aware of that. Q. Was there formerly an option between Irving and Wil- lard Schools? aay A. Yes. Q. And there were three options in a row there, weren’t there, on kind of a diagonal? A. Yes. They involved Willard and Irving, Willard and Whittier, and Miami Chapel and Whittier, and those were three triangles, two of which were bounded on two sides by railroads and the third was bounded on one side by a railroad. Q. And what was the reason that they were set i De Phir y et up without 407 A. Because of the hazard giving the option not to cross the railroad. Q. Then, as we move on through the city, there was at one time an option between Cleveland, Lincoln, and Franklin Elementary Schools, was there not? A. That was caused by the construction of Highway 35 and its exit ramps which changed the accessibility factor ma- terially. Q. What was the reason for not drawing that one with hard lines? A. Well, I think it was left to the pleasure of the parents how they were going to instruct their children to go to school because of the difficulty of access. Q. Now, at one time were there some elementary school optional areas involving Orville Wright Elementary School? A. Orville Wright and Kemp, the eastern area I have it as approximately equadistant, and the southern area was acces- sibility. Q. Was there any reason for drawing those as optional areas rather than hard lines? A. Again, there is no justification to refuse the request of parents. oO ° oO Q. Mr. Curk, you testified this morning you obtained the racial counts which are found in PX-104; that is, the 1940 to 1951 racial data, that you obtained these from principals’ reports? A. 1940 to 1951? Q. I think 1947 to 1951. I am sorry. A. Well, I don’t remember the report, Mr. Lucas, but there is an attached document to that which indicated that I did get it from the principals’ report as I gave in direct testimony this morning. Q You said that the principals reported at the end of the year and one of the questions on the principals’ report to the State Department of Education was the number of Negroes enrolled in that particular school that particular year. 408 A. That’s my understanding, yes. wae, Q. So, from 1947 to 1951, at least, the principals’ reports carried that information to the staff, is that right? A. Evidently. I don’t remember it, but evidently from that document. ‘ [R. I. 1921-1922, Vol. 19] Q. And you were present and, therefore, knew what the decision-making process was during that period of time? : A. Normally I was present, yes, sir. Q. And I believe you also stated that after Dr. Goff took Mr. Ammstrong’s place — was it in 1964? A. I think that was the year. Q. But you were not as involved but was kept advised of any major decisions and memorandum; is that correct? A. That's correct. Q. And did you go to the Parker School? A. I did. Q. Maybe I am embarrassing you, but can you give the year you went to Parker School? A. Well, let’s see. I will have to count backwards. It would be in the year 1919-1920, I think. Q. Was Parker a city-wide ninth grade school? A. I think it was at that time. Q. So, just one grade was in that building? A. That correct. Q. Do you recall how many students that involved at that time? One A. I have no way of knowing. Q. Was that building still in use when you came with the System as an Administrator? A. Yes, it was. Q. Now that I have referenced that, can you give any idea of the size of the building in terms of capacity? A. Well, it was put to a different use, of course, in sub- sequent years, and that would probably decrease the number of students that it could accommodate due to its different usage, but I would still hesitate to hazard a guess. 409 Q. But it was the co-op school for Patterson; is that correct? A. That is correct. Q. Now, this was a city-wide ninth grade. Were there any other ninth grades in the System that you know of? A. Not to my knowledge. Q. And that was part of the junior high setup that the System had back then? A. This is before the junior high, sir. Q. That’s right. Junior high started in the ’20’s? A. That’s correct. Q. O. K. Were there attendance boundaries for other schools at that time? I take it the attendance boundary for the ninth grade was the entire city limits. A. Yes, sir. ° ° ° [R. I. 1928-1931, Vol. 19] A. Before I could answer that question, the foreword to that table says “The following table is based upon the present rating capacity of each building”, and so forth, Pages 8, 9, 10 and 25, I guess it is, of this survey. Q. The next paragraph though says “The estimated num- ber of pupils from Mad River Township was based upon esti- mates secured from the county superintendent’s office and our own experience table.” I guess my first question is, at the time this report was prepared were the Mad River children coming in to those schools? A. Evidently so, yes, sir. Q. And am I reading the table correctly to say that 636 was the number and that the numbers that appear thereafter are the projections that you are making? A. I think that would be correct. Q. Do you know whether or not the enrollment patterns actually continued as projected or did they drop off or cease? A. Are you talking about the Mad River students? Q. Yes, sir. 410 A. I don’t remember whether I continued updating that attendance record or not. Q. How long did they continue to utilize space in those schools? A. I can’t answer that question either, because it is recom- mended and I think whatever the year was, I think they were in the process of erecting their own high school building, and it wasn’t two years after that they stopped bussing their chil- dren in. Q. They provided the bussing into these schools? A. Oh, yes. Q. And did this affect in any way your capacity decisions in terms of having to add the capacity of various schools because of this influx of students? A. No. When you say various schools, you are referring to what, sir? Q. Assume, and I’m trying to read your table, and if I am wrong please correct me, but this Mad River assignment applies to Kiser, Wilbur Wright and Stivers only. A. And it is a heading which applies to their new high school. Q. This says available space in high school buildings, and the last column has Mad River High School pupils, so I assume that that affects those three schools and only those three schools? A. Well, the projection included the new high school. That’s what I’m trying to tell you. There is a column for the new high school, and the other columns would be adjusted accordingly. Q. And you are in effect including in your projection of high school needs at that time building and space then for these Mad River Township children? A. No, I don’t think so, bebcause I think as I read trying to prepare my answer for you, on Page 8 I said excluding the Mad River Township pupils. I think that is on Page §. Q. “They do not include any large number of tuition 4li pupils such as those that we receive from Mad River Town- ship.” The question is, does the table in Part V, where you have those additional numbers in the right-hand column, is that reflected at all in the utilization figures that you have for those other schools; Kiser, Wilbur Wright and Stivers? A. No. For instance, just to check, in 1955-56, 225, 330 would be 555, and 289 would be 844, and 714, you come up with your 1522. Well, it’s blurred so that could not include the 763 that is out to the right-hand table or column. Q. Well, this column says that is available space, and I take it that means in 1955-56 there were 225 spaces in Kiser, 300, and it looks like 360 spaces in Wilbur Wright, and 289 spaces in Stivers; is that correct? A. I think that would be correct. Q. All right. That indicates that you have whatever the sum of that is in spaces available as of ’55-56, and then you are projecting a new high school to add a total of 714 spaces, is that correct, because it doesn’t exist. You projected it. A. Yes. Q. All right. So that the sum of the total, in the second to last column, would be the sum of extra space available, as- suming the new high school was built? A. That’s correct. Q. So that you have that much extra space, 1588, or maybe 1533. It’s a little blurred. A. Yes. Projected for that particular year. There would be that much extra space, and you pro- jected you would have 753 Mad River pupils for that period, didn’t you? A. Correct. Q. Thank you for clearing that up. Now, in your deposition you told Mr. Diamond that you never considered race whatsoever. A. In projecting enrollments, that is absolutely correct. 412 [R. I. 1953-1954, Vol. 19] Q. Are you familiar with what areas that you were doing transportation in before you retired? A. That was not my domain, but I was familiar with some of them, yes. Q. Can you give me several illustrations? A. Well, in the northeast was probably most difficult. Formerly, the northeast area was all transported to McGuffey, Webster and Allen, and then it was reduced to Webster and Allen and that, of course, was again an accessibility pattern as well as distance, and then in the extreme northwest, the people out around the extreme upper left of the map. Q. Can you refer to it by school zone now? A. Well, it is in the Shiloh zone. Q. Thank you. A. And those people were bused into Shiloh. Q. They would have gone to Meadowdale at that time? A. Well, the period I am talking about, they went to Fair- view. Q. Was there any transportation down in the southeast area? A. There was at one time transportation in the Wogaman area when Wogaman was overcrowded and the bus went down in the southern Harrison Township area. Q. When Wogaman was overcrowded what period would that have been, approximately? A. Well, I think that would cover a span of years. I don't know. Q. Fifties or sixties? A. I am referring to early ’50’s before Highview was con- structed, Highview being constructed it had a tendency to relieve Wogaman, and then — Q. Highview — A. Do you want me to continue? Q. Highview, I believe, was built in 1951. A. I think so. Q. All right. You say that the Wogaman children were taken to where? 413 A. Well, the Highview District was a part of the Wogaman District at that time, and Wogaman was overcrowded and pupils were bussed, I think, to Irving. Q. You mentioned something about Harrison Township. A. Well, the southern part of that area at that time was not in the city, but a part — now wait a minute. It might have been, but it was formerly southern Harrison Township. Maybe it was in the city at that time. I can’t say for sure. Q. The Highview School when it opened was only one percent black? A. That’s right. Q. Were the white children being taken to Irving? A. Well, I presume so. Q. Instead of going to Wogaman which was overcrowded and which was black, they were taken to Irving? A. That’s right. Z. TESTIMONY OF WILLIAM GOFF. [R. I. 1959, Vol. 19] Q. Try to keep your voice up so I can hear you way back here and let’s start out by asking your name. A. William Goff. Q. Where do you live, Mr. Goff? A. In Dayton, Ohio, 918 Debbie Court. Q. What is your occupation? A. I am Assistant Superintendent of Schools for Student Development. Q. How long have you held that position? A. Just over eight years. I have been Assistant Superintendent for four years. I have been in Dayton for eight years. Q. Can you give us your educational background? A. Yes. I attained a Bachelor's Degree in Psychology at 414 Ohio State and Master’s Degree in Psychology at Ohio State University and the Doctorate in Exceptional Children Guid- ance and Educational Administration at Ohio State. [R. I. 1962-1963, Vol. 19] Q. What had been the practice of the Board with respect to transportation of students insofar as distances are concerned? A. You mean prior to this policy? Q. Prior to and after 1966. A. Well, after 1966 the policy as it is stated here, did estab- lish a 1.2 radial distance from an elementary school, that is outside the 1.2 mile, being a transportation area. It also set up a series of criteria for high school transporta- tion, too. The State law, as you are probably aware, does require only that students who are in elementary schools be transported if they are two miles or more from their school of attendance. This was at this time. Q. All right. Was that the practice and policy of the Board? A. The practice of the Board made use of the permissive part of the law which allowed over one mile from the school. So the 1.2 mile policy that was established here fit into the practice that was being exercised in 1966. Q. What were the financial implications of the Board's transportation policy in the 60's? A. Well, as a flat rate school district, the district received nothing for any kind of transportation of regular students. There was reimbursement for handicapped children attend- ing Gorman School for Crippled Children. [R. I. 1998, Vol. 20] A. The primary limitation in setting up the sites was the one and a half mile direct travel distance which was the transportation policy so that the youngsters could walk to the school rather than be involved in transporta- 415 tion. There were a number of other sites suggested, were there not? If I can name a few, tell me if I am correct. Jane Ad- dams was suggested as a middle school, was it not? Q. Jane Addams, Meadowdale, Brown, Emerson, Kiser were those some of the other schools? A. I think some of these were identified in an Ohio State study prior to the time that we finally set them up, yes, sir. Q. Emerson is actually a former junior high school; is that correct? A. I believe so. Q. And that would make it particularly suitable for con- version to a middle school? A. Yes. ra oe" “ poet mee 19] Q. Try to keep your voice up, r. Gott, because the Reporter also has to get A. Isee. All right, iG ea: The middle school, we looked for possibilities of middle school placement on the east side, on the west side, and in the north part of the city. : We had the assistance of Ohio State Universi sity through a grant that they had to put youngsters on large maps so a we knew where they were, since we do not have a central file system right now on every youngster, and with these maps we establish the individual schools in three sections of the city using what buildings we felt could be most adaptable to a middle school, and those who could best handle the eight to five youngsters. Q. Was there any new construction involved? A. No, sir. Q. What students interracial experi i perience, if any, were af- fected by the establishment of the five middle schools? Maybe you had best take them one at a time. What about Orville Wright? 416 A. At Orville Wright, as far as a racial integration at that school, this was improved for the six to eight level by bringing youngsters who were formerly attending Washington Ele- mentary School. F ranklin Elementary School, nothing was accomplished there as far as any racial improvement. At Kemp School, the racial improvement there as noted on this exhibit, was due pri narily to a housing development, not to a change in the boundary. And in Washington School, Washington Elementary School, this did bring more white youngsters into Washington School. It brought white youngsters into Washington School who had not previously been with black children at this particular age level, and of course, it took out some of the older black chil- dren to go to Orville Wright. Q. Allright. And are the various mixtures and nonmixture of the races in the other middle schools shown on this Exhibit AW? A. Yes, they are. ae Q. Was there any reason for not establishing more than these five middle schools? A. Well, it was felt that to begin with, with five middle schools, it was a pretty big bite in itself, and so basically this was an arbitrary decision, really, not to go into the whole district at once. We were also introducing the individually guided educa- tional program into the middle schools and into their feeder schools. So this, too, meant another kind of planning and re- organization for those schools. Q. What is your relationship to the freedom of enrollment program that has been effected in the Dayton School System since its adoption in May of 1969? ahctek A. The associate director for student relations administers the program itself. I am his direct supervisor, and we work together when problem situations come up in the interpretation of the policy or how we would administer it. 417 Mr. Carroll is directly responsible for that, but he is a mem- ber of my staff. Q. All right. The Court is already fully familiar with the policy and the various priorities in it. Could you tell us just how the mechanics of the freedom of enrollment works? Are there cutoff dates or when is enroll- ment in the program effected? | A. Well, there is a time, and it has been twice a year enrollment dates, when youngsters may make applications for freedom of enrollment. Administratively we would like to have a cutoff date simply to be able to clean things up. Our practice has been that we do accept youngsters even right on to until the time that the second semester begins, or the first semester and the fall begins. So we actually have no cutoff date. We have a begin- ning enrollment date when youngsters and their families are asked then to send their application in. Q. How are enrollments projected for the freedom of enrollment program? A. The guidelines that Mr. Carroll and I worked together on were simply to contact the principales of schools where youngsters had requested transfer and to get a number from those schools at various grade levels where the principal felt that he would have room. There is a comparison of this with the tentative organization that the principal must submit to the staff development department in the spring in order to plan for teachers for the coming year. Q. What is the tentative organization for each school and how is it developed? A. I guess a staff development person can answer this better, but primarily the principal and his staff must assess and make projections of their enrollments, relate this to their classroom space, and the number of teachers they then have, and then present that particular relationship to the staff development department for review. There are various criteria established in Title I schools as ee en a 418 opposed to non-Title I schools. That is, the ratio, and I'm sorry, I don’t remember these, but they differ for a center city school as oposed to a suburb, that is, the Title I being a lower pupil-teacher ratio. So the principal then uses this figure to estimate how many teachers he is going to need for the coming year. Q. All right. And is the capacity insofar as freedom of enrollment is concerned tied in with the tentative organiza- tion worked out for each school by these various criteria? A. Well, the principal himself is normally — for instance, right at this period of time, for transfers, he doesn’t have a tentative enrollment. We are asking him if he has a vacancy for second semester. For the second semester he has a tentative enrollment, or a TO worked out, so that we can make some judgment as to whether or not he does have room in relation to what he is asking for as far as teachers are con- cerned. But we have depended upon the principal to give us this figure. Are you aware of anything to indicate that the free- dom of enrollment program has not worked in a fair and im- partial manner for all students in the system? A. No, sir, I’m not. Q. According to Defendants’ Exhibit AD, in the present school year, there are only 178 students out of more than 50,000 in the System who were denied transfers under the freedom of enrollment program because of classroom space. Are those figures and similar figures in the other exhibits concerning freedom of enrollment accurate to the best of your knowledge? A. Yes, they are. Q. What are hardship and emergency transfers, Dr. Goff? A. These are individual kinds of situations which develop with a child or a student in a school which are a program in his adjustment or in his making progress in school, and each of these individual situations is reviewed to see whether or not it is apropriate to make any school transfers or whether 419 any other kinds of changes need to be made to assist that youngster in his school development. Q. Let me refer you to Plaintiffs’ Exhibit 16, which sum- marizes the hardship and emergency transfers for the present school year. Do racial considerations play any part in hardship or emer- gency transfers, Dr. Goff? A. No, sir, not within this policy at all. Q. What are special education transfers? A. These are youngsters who are evaluated by school psychologists in relation to abilities, in relation to achievement, performance in school, and if eligible for state standard self- contained classes for educable mentally retarded, they are then placed into such a class with the parents’ permission. If there is no such class available for a particular age range at a school, that youngster is transferred to the nearest school where there is such a class available. Q. Do racial considerations play any part in such transfers or assignments? A. No, sir, they do not. Q. What are disciplinary transfers? A. I would assume the question really parallels the hard- ship and the passionate kind of transfers that does involve an evaluation of a situation in which a youngster has been involved in a discipline kind of way. And if it is indicated that a school transfer would be helpful in improved adjustment for this youngster, such a transfer might be made. Q. Do disciplinary transfers occur both within and without the context of the freedom of enrollment program? A. Actually, they are without the context of the freedom of enrollment program. Disciplinary transfers are not con- sidered freedom of enrollment transfers. Q. And what are the criteria by which such transfers would be made? 420 A. Well, there would be a number of these. Actually we are looking at the child’s immediate kind of adjustment in a par- ticular kind of situation. But before a transfer would normally be made, we would also be expecting some other kind of sup- porting help for that youngster really outside the school system in most cases. A caseworker from the Family and Children’s Services, from the Juvenile Court, a continuing treatment program with a child guidance center, a children’s psychiatric hospital under psychiatric treatment. We look for something to give support to the child beyond just a matter of his being transferred from one school to the other. Q. Do racial considerations play any part in these kind of transfers? A. No, sir. Q. Now, during your tenure with the Board, there have been a few special transfer situations involving Jefferson, Edi- son and Westwood Schools, have there not? A. Yes, sir. Q. I'll refer you to Defendants’ Exhibit BA. Q. Now, the Court is already familiar with these three situations, I think, so I will try to confine my questions to just certain aspects of them. First of all, can you tell me the circumstances that led up to the Jefferson transfers and what caused those transfers to stop? A. The Jefferson transfers were due to the crowded situ- ation on that Jefferson campus. Q. Were the Westwood transfers a situation similar to the Jefferson transfers? A. Yes, sir. Q. And on the transfers from the Edison students follow- ing the Edison fire, was there a meeting of administrators the week following the fire, in April of 1968? ? 421 A. Yes, sir, there was. Q. Were you present at that meeting? A. Yes, I was. Q. Was any plan adopted at that meeting regarding the assimilation of those students and the schools to which they were transferred? A The plan adopted for the remainder of that school year was to transfer the teachers with the students to the schools to which they were assigned. Q. Did the administrators the week following the fire adopt any plan with regard to what would be done the following fall? A. I know of no plan being adopted for the following fall. My impression was that we were dealing with an immediate situation at this time and we felt that these youngsters should not be disrupted from their normal class. [R. I. 1991-1994, Vol. 20] Q. You were with the system in 1970, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. Are you familiar with the transfer of two children named Fielder (spelling) F-i-e-l-d-e-r, from Roth to another school in the system? I believe it resulted in a law suit in which the Dayton School System was involved? A. Yes, sir. I remember the case, not the details. Q. I believe these students were Rob and Beverly Fielder, who were attempting to transfer from Roth. Do you know what school they were attempting to go to? A. No, sir, I don’t recall specifically. Q. Do you know what happened in that case? A. As best I can recall, the case involving the girl in the family was brought to a preliminary kind of hearing in court. Q. Let me ask you and see if I am correct. The School Board did oppose the transfer of the students as 422 had been requested by the parents, and the parent filed suit, is that correct? A. I’m sorr [Text truncated at 120,000 characters. The full text is on the page linked above.] --- Source: Frix Law Library, https://www.frixlaw.com/law-library/documents/brief%3Amicro_IA40385005_1894%3A03. Public record. Not legal advice.